# FreeBSD 13.0 - Intel Haswell DT-GT 1.5 Integrated Graphics GPU



## Babinio74 (Sep 21, 2021)

Hello

I've just installed FreeBSD 13.0 on a Lenovo Thinkpad M73 machine that comes with an Intel Haswell DT-GT 1.5 Integrated Graphics GPU (Intel HD Graphics 4400). 

I'm just wondering if i should download and install an appropriate driver or if the OS is supporting this GPU out of the box.

 Just to mention that machine is connected with a VGA simple monitor.

Thank in advance


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## SirDice (Sep 21, 2021)

If you're only using the console (no graphics) then you don't need a driver at all. For Xorg you should install graphics/drm-kmod.


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## Babinio74 (Sep 21, 2021)

SirDice said:


> If you're only using the console (no graphics) then you don't need a driver at all. For Xorg you should install graphics/drm-kmod.


I'm using Xorg (xfce4), thank you for your reply


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## astyle (Sep 21, 2021)

Read this, the section titled "Intel Integrated Graphics (aka HD Graphics)". It seems to be  a good fit for the specs OP posted. Installing graphics/drm-kmod as per advice from SirDice is only the start, there's still a few more steps before you have a working desktop. Handbook is also a great place to look - *after* completing the steps in the wiki I linked to initially.


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## jbo (Sep 21, 2021)

The screenshot from your post: Is that a utility available from ports?


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## astyle (Sep 21, 2021)

jbodenmann said:


> The screenshot from your post: Is that a utility available from ports?


nope, it's not. This is from a Windows installation.


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## Babinio74 (Sep 21, 2021)

jbodenmann said:


> The screenshot from your post: Is that a utility available from ports?


No, its a windows based utility for a second same PC i have


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## Babinio74 (Sep 21, 2021)

astyle said:


> Read this, the section titled "Intel Integrated Graphics (aka HD Graphics)". It seems to be  a good fit for the specs OP posted. Installing graphics/drm-kmod as per advice from SirDice is only the start, there's still a few more steps before you have a working desktop. Handbook is also a great place to look - *after* completing the steps in the wiki I linked to initially.


I carefully read the threat i stuck here:


Ensure your UID is a member of the "video" group.


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## matt_k (Sep 21, 2021)

Babinio74 said:


> I carefully read the threat i stuck here:
> 
> 
> Ensure your UID is a member of the "video" group.


You are stuck there?

Well then, check if your user is a member of the "video" group. If not, add him there.
As per pw() manpage:

```
Add the existing user jsmith to the wheel group, in addition to the other groups jsmith is already a member of.

pw groupmod wheel -m jsmith
```


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## astyle (Sep 21, 2021)

matt_k said:


> You are stuck there?


Read the quote carefully... 




Babinio74 said:


> I carefully read the threat i stuck here:


Unless I'm mistaken, that would mean "I wrote that". matt_k, even as a joke, the following (which came earlier in the thread) should have tipped you off:


Babinio74 said:


> I'm using Xorg (xfce4), thank you for your reply


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## Babinio74 (Sep 21, 2021)

I think that I have corrupted my system when I rebooted it.

I’ve install the system again and I will follow this guide more carefully

Just to mention that it’s my first time in BSD Unix and I’m trying to learn as much as possible I can

Just to ask this: is it necessary to install the driver?My system behaves quickly and it’s a powerful and stable workstation now

Maybe a YouTube video will help me fix my graphics


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## astyle (Sep 22, 2021)

Babinio74 said:


> I think that I have corrupted my system when I rebooted it.
> 
> I’ve install the system again and I will follow this guide more carefully
> 
> ...


I don't think the system is corrupted - a mis-configured graphics driver can make I/O unusable. The basic logic is:

Install the correct graphics driver (using command line). Yes, that is needed.
Enable it correctly (there's different config files that can be used, like /boot/loader.conf, /etc/rc.conf, refer to the Handbook for instructions)
Follow Handbook's instructions for installing XFCE.
Install and enable the l*ogin manager* for XFCE.
Once steps above are done, then you can reboot. 
If you mess up the config steps above, that does not mean a corrupted system. One option for fixing that is using SSH to get in and fix the config files using command-line utilities. If that's not an option, then yeah, go ahead and re-install, following instructions in the Handbook.

As for YouTube - Try correlating what you see with Handbook's instructions, and pay attention to when YouTube content deviates from the latest Handbook content.


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## SirDice (Sep 22, 2021)

Babinio74 said:


> I think that I have corrupted my system when I rebooted it.
> 
> I’ve install the system again and I will follow this guide more carefully
> 
> Just to mention that it’s my first time in BSD Unix and I’m trying to learn as much as possible I can


One good lesson to learn here is how to fix this _without_ resorting to reinstalling the whole system. It's not corrupted, it may be crashing during boot though. One way to try and solve this is by booting to single user mode and removing the last change you've made. If booting to single user mode also crashes the system then you should learn how to work with the loader(8) to unload the kernel (and the module that caused the crash), then loading a clean kernel _without_ that module and booting the system that way.


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## Babinio74 (Sep 22, 2021)

SirDice said:


> One good lesson to learn here is how to fix this _without_ resorting to reinstalling the whole system. It's not corrupted, it may be crashing during boot though. One way to try and solve this is by booting to single user mode and removing the last change you've made. If booting to single user mode also crashes the system then you should learn how to work with the loader(8) to unload the kernel (and the module that caused the crash), then loading a clean kernel _without_ that module and booting the system that way.


i did boot with single user mode, then delete the drm package, reboot and still the same. 

i have to learn a lot around here since its my first experience with unix and  command lines


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## astyle (Sep 22, 2021)

Babinio74 said:


> i did boot with single user mode, then delete the drm package, reboot and still the same.
> 
> i have to learn a lot around here since its my first experience with unix and  command lines


We did not mean for you to delete the drm package... graphics/drm-kmod is a bit of a catch-all that will most likely cover the GPU you mentioned you have. But yeah, it's important to get comfortable with command line first. Userland utilities like cd, ls, cat, less, and more (yes, there is such a utility, `/bin/more`, although it's a little old, and `/bin/less` is more commonly used).


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## SirDice (Sep 22, 2021)

astyle said:


> yes, there is such a utility, `/bin/more`, although it's a little old, and `/bin/less` is more commonly used).


On FreeBSD less(1) and more(1) are the same executable. But it has different behavior based on the way it is executed.


```
dice@hosaka:~ % ls -li /usr/bin/more /usr/bin/less
818553 -r-xr-xr-x  2 root  wheel  185672 Sep 15 15:23 /usr/bin/less
818553 -r-xr-xr-x  2 root  wheel  185672 Sep 15 15:23 /usr/bin/more
```
For the uninitiated, the inodes (the first number on the lines) are the same of those files. Which means they are hard-linked. In simpler words, they both point to the same file content on disk.


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## astyle (Sep 22, 2021)

SirDice , I wonder if we got a bit too complicated for OP... Yeah, we point out obscure trivia, while OP still needs to get comfortable with just navigating the command line. It took me awhile to warm up to UNIX and command line back in the day. We'd know how to pipe compiler messages to termbin.com, while OP still needs to install editors/nano to edit config files and correlate their content to results he sees at reboot. FWIW, I still need to have a command reference handy if I have to use vi(1).


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## SirDice (Sep 22, 2021)

astyle said:


> I wonder if we got a bit too complicated for OP.


You may be right. 


Babinio74 said:


> i did boot with single user mode, then delete the drm package, reboot and still the same.


What _exactly_ is happening when you boot? Try to explain what you're seeing. In this case I'll even settle for a picture. We can't see what's happening on your end so we have to rely on the information you're giving us.


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## Deleted member 30996 (Sep 22, 2021)

Babinio74 said:


> ...its my first experience with unix and command lines


That's my cue...

What I have for you, Babinio74, yes you, is a Beginners Tutorial with a target audience of someone who has never used the command line that takes you from installation of the FreeBSD Base System to a fully functional Fluxbox Window Manager FreeBSD desktop using ports to compile third party programs.

You can substitute pkg for ports by referencing the FreeBSD Handbook for instruction, still follow the basic outline and acquire some valuable command line experience in doing so.









						Beginners Guide - How To Set Up A FreeBSD Desktop From Scratch
					

I'm going to guide you though the process of getting a fully functional FreeBSD 13.0-RELEASE desktop up and running, complete with system files and security settings, step-by-step as if you've never used UNIX or the command line. Now let's get started:  Insert your boot media and at the Welcome...




					forums.freebsd.org
				




You'll have to figure out your video driver issues as that's outside the scope of the tutorial, but once at the DE/WM of your choice there are System and Security files that require editing. I provide examples of doing so, a pf firewall ruleset for general desktop use and an adaptation for people who use CUPS.

I would have played you some Cake but was overcome by Infectious Grooves.

There are 12 individual pages of  FreeBSD forum member screenshots showing different DE and WM in use and over 50 wallpapers on my site to help make up for it.



			Wallpapers by Trihexagonal
		


And it's all free!


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## Babinio74 (Sep 22, 2021)

Trihexagonal said:


> Trihexagonal said:
> 
> 
> > That's my cue...
> ...


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## Babinio74 (Sep 22, 2021)

SirDice said:


> You may be right.
> 
> What _exactly_ is happening when you boot? Try to explain what you're seeing. In this case I'll even settle for a picture. We can't see what's happening on your end so we have to rely on the information you're giving us.


Next time i will use Screenshots when i got stuck in various issues, now i have installed system again


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## Babinio74 (Sep 22, 2021)

astyle said:


> We did not mean for you to delete the drm package... graphics/drm-kmod is a bit of a catch-all that will most likely cover the GPU you mentioned you have. But yeah, it's important to get comfortable with command line first. Userland utilities like cd, ls, cat, less, and more (yes, there is such a utility, `/bin/more`, although it's a little old, and `/bin/less` is more commonly used).


nevermind, i have re-installed a fresh copy of freebsd and im learning from my mistakes..


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## Babinio74 (Sep 22, 2021)

matt_k said:


> You are stuck there?
> 
> Well then, check if your user is a member of the "video" group. If not, add him there.
> As per pw() manpage:
> ...


so ,* pw groupmod video -m (user name)*    is the correct command to create a video group and add (user name) there?


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## astyle (Sep 22, 2021)

Babinio74 said:


> nevermind, i have re-installed a fresh copy of freebsd and im learning from my mistakes..


Enjoy! This is how I learned, too. It took time for me to get comfortable, and to allow FreeBSD to soak into my brain.


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## matt_k (Sep 22, 2021)

Babinio74 said:


> so ,* pw groupmod video -m (user name)*    is the correct command to create a video group and add (user name) there?


you don't create "video" group with that command.
"video" group must already exists when you execute that command.
That command just adds user (user name) to the already existing "video" group.

For creating groups, you use the command `pw groupadd`
I don't remember creating the "video" group thou, I think it already exists on default FreeBSD installation. 
you can look if the video group already exists (and its GID and members) with `pw group show video`


```
~> pw group show video
video:*:44:matt_k,goatse
~> pw group show wheel
wheel:*:0:root,matt_k
```


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## astyle (Sep 22, 2021)

matt_k said:


> you don't create "video" group with that command.
> "video" group must already exists when you execute that command.
> That command just adds user (user name) to the already existing "video" group.
> 
> ...


You got this mixed up... just check the pw(8) manpage, and the Handbook for proper usage.


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## Deleted member 30996 (Sep 22, 2021)

From my tutorial, during the Base System installation process, after you set your root password it gives you the chance to create a usr account. And here we go:



> Now's your chance to add a User account. Less privileged than root, it's what you'll be running in 99.9% of the time.
> 
> When asked if you want to invite the user to other groups make them members of:




```
wheel operator
```



Trihexagonal said:


> Typed just like that.
> 
> Enter a password for that account, for the rest of the options choose the default option it recommends and just hit Enter to proceed from one to the next.
> 
> One account should be enough. When asked if you want to make another user account type no and hit Enter.


Now we're at the desktop, way down the page:



> You should still be in your root account in urxvt, so enter:



`leafpad`



> To bring up that text editor as root. Copy this text into leafpad:




```
[devfsrules_common=7]
add path 'ad*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'da*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'acd*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'cd*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'mmcsd*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'pass*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'xpt*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'ugen*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'usbctl' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'usb*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'lpt*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'ulpt*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'unlpt*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'fd*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'uscan*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'video*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'dvb/*' mode 0666 group operator
```

And save as /etc/devfs.rules.

Now you are a member of the video group.

If you don't have editors/leafpad installed, now is a good time to do it. Or use a text editor you know. vi comes with the Base System.


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## astyle (Sep 22, 2021)

yeah, I just add *video* to the list of groups (that I should be part of) during the install process. Takes some planning and studying documentation.


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## matt_k (Sep 22, 2021)

astyle said:


> You got this mixed up... just check the pw(8) manpage, and the Handbook for proper usage.


Yeah, I apologize. I screwed that up. I should've checked more thoroughly before posting here.


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## grahamperrin@ (Sep 30, 2021)

Trihexagonal said:


> … `wheel operator` … Now you are a member of the video group. …



Nit: that's groups _wheel_ and _operator_ but not _video_. 

(I know, operator will have the required effect in this case, but there's the potential to confuse a newcomer.)


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## Deleted member 30996 (Sep 30, 2021)

grahamperrin said:


> Nit: that's groups _wheel_ and _operator_ but not _video_.
> 
> (I know, operator will have the required effect in this case, but there's the potential to confuse a newcomer.)


Read the whole damn post.


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## grahamperrin@ (Sep 30, 2021)

Trihexagonal said:


> damn



I did read it. Why so aggressive?


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## astyle (Sep 30, 2021)

grahamperrin said:


> I did read it. Why so aggressive?


So did I. I realize our own mistakes are uncomfortable to accept when others point them out. However, Trihexagonal , grahamperrin happens to be correct. It does take some paying attention to realize that `video` part is actually missing from that post.


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## Deleted member 30996 (Sep 30, 2021)

astyle said:


> So did I. I realize our own mistakes are uncomfortable to accept when others point them out. However, Trihexagonal , grahamperrin happens to be correct. It does take some paying attention to realize that `video` part is actually missing from that post.


No it is not.


Trihexagonal said:


> add path 'video*' mode 0666 group operator


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## grahamperrin@ (Sep 30, 2021)

Trihexagonal said:


> add path 'video*' mode 0666 group operator





grahamperrin said:


> groups _wheel_ and _operator_ but not _video_.



Groups, not paths. 

On a test machine, for example:


```
root@mowa219-gjp4-vm-freebsd-13-zfs:~ # pw groupmod video -d grahamperrin
root@mowa219-gjp4-vm-freebsd-13-zfs:~ # cat /etc/devfs.rules
[devfsrules_common=7]
add path 'ad*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'da*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'acd*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'cd*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'mmcsd*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'pass*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'xpt*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'ugen*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'usbctl' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'usb*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'lpt*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'ulpt*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'unlpt*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'fd*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'uscan*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'video*' mode 0666 group operator
add path 'dvb/*' mode 0666 group operator
root@mowa219-gjp4-vm-freebsd-13-zfs:~ # grep grahamperrin /etc/group
wheel:*:0:root,grahamperrin,percy,test
operator:*:5:root,grahamperrin
grahamperrin:*:1001:
root@mowa219-gjp4-vm-freebsd-13-zfs:~ # exit
logout
grahamperrin@mowa219-gjp4-vm-freebsd-13-zfs:~ % sudo shutdown -r now
Password:
```

_grahamperrin_ is not (no longer) a member of the _video_ *group*.


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## monwarez (Sep 30, 2021)

Trihexagonal said:


> ...
> 
> ```
> [devfsrules_common=7]
> ...



I don't understand why you give all this access to the operator group, you can easily delete an entire drive by using the raw access to the sata drives (and usb). I don't know for you, but when I am at my normal user I don't expect it to be able to delete everything.

Same for video, there is a group that is created specifically for this task why not just add the user to the correct group ?


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## grahamperrin@ (Sep 30, 2021)

monwarez said:


> … why not just add the user to the correct group ?





grahamperrin said:


> … operator will have the required effect in this case, …



If I recall correctly: membership of _operator_ effectively negates the requirement to be a member of _video_. 

As an _operator_, a member can (also) benefit from things such as a broader range of options in a log out dialogue, for example: 




_hint – don't click that button_
– all of which might be pleasantly but  wildly off-topic from the opening post, however this _is_ FreeBSD Forums.


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## shkhln (Sep 30, 2021)

grahamperrin said:


> If I recall correctly: membership of _operator_ effectively negates the requirement to be a member of _video_.


No, of course not. video and operator are not some magical entities with superpowers, those are just groups to which some nodes in /dev belong by default. And in Unix files can only have _one_ group.


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## grahamperrin@ (Oct 1, 2021)

shkhln said:


> video and operator are not some magical entities



That's not what I suggested.

Has anyone encountered a case where a member of _operator_ must also be a member of _video_?


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## shkhln (Oct 1, 2021)

I'm not sure what answer do you want. In order to be able to use 3d acceleration Mesa libs open things like /dev/dri/card0 (to communicate with the kernel driver). These nodes should have ownership user=root, group=video and 0660 permissions by default.


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## grahamperrin@ (Oct 1, 2021)

I see wrongness in package messages such as <https://www.freshports.org/graphics/drm-current-kmod/#message> and <https://www.freshports.org/graphics/drm-fbsd13-kmod/#message>. If no-one else reports a bug, I will.



grahamperrin said:


> If I recall correctly: membership of _operator_ effectively negates the requirement to be a member of _video_.



Probably some muddled recollection. Sorry.

From the 2019 _FreeBSD Journal_ article, A Guide To Getting Started With FreeBSD:



> … Add the user account to the groups *wheel, operator, video* …



– however pages such as <https://people.freebsd.org/~murray/handbook/x-config.html#x-config-user-group> suggest that membership of _wheel_ (not operator) negates the requirement to be a member of _video_. Much the same at <https://docs.freebsd.org/en/books/handbook/x11/#x-config-user-group>.

Here, after removing myself from the _video_ group on my everyday computer:


```
% grep grahamperrin /etc/group | sort
grahamperrin:*:1002:
operator:*:5:root,grahamperrin,bbsadmin-l
vboxusers:*:920:grahamperrin,bbsadmin-l
webcamd:*:145:grahamperrin
wheel:*:0:root,grahamperrin,bbsadmin-l
% cat /etc/devfs.rules
[system=10]
add path 'usb/*' mode 0660 group operator
add path 'acd*' mode 0666
add path 'cd*' mode 0666
add path 'pass*' mode 0666
add path 'xpt*' mode 0666

% ls -hl /dev/dri
total 0
lrwxr-xr-x  1 root  wheel     8B  1 Oct 02:39 card0 -> ../drm/0
lrwxr-xr-x  1 root  wheel    10B  1 Oct 02:39 renderD128 -> ../drm/128
% uname -KU
1400033 1400033
% freebsd-version -kru
14.0-CURRENT
14.0-CURRENT
14.0-CURRENT
%
```


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## shkhln (Oct 1, 2021)

grahamperrin said:


> ```
> % ls -hl /dev/dri
> total 0
> lrwxr-xr-x  1 root  wheel     8B  1 Oct 02:39 card0 -> ../drm/0
> ...


Probably just symlink permissions. Those usually do not matter. Check the actual symlink targets. (Although this is somewhat curious, considering the code: https://github.com/freebsd/freebsd-...a51307f9f2e/sys/dev/drm2/drm_stub.c#L369-L387, https://github.com/freebsd/freebsd-...b4a51307f9f2e/sys/dev/drm2/drmP.h#L1596-L1598.)


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## grahamperrin@ (Oct 1, 2021)

```
% ls -hl /dev/drm/0
crw-rw----  1 root  video   0xe5  1 Oct 03:38 /dev/drm/0
% ls -hl /dev/drm/128
crw-rw----  1 root  video  0x165  1 Oct 03:38 /dev/drm/128
%
```


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## grahamperrin@ (Oct 1, 2021)

grahamperrin said:


> Has anyone encountered a case where a member of _operator_ must also be a member of _video_?



▼



grahamperrin said:


> It appears that I have hardware acceleration *without* membership of the _video_ group. (I'm an _operator_.)


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## astyle (Oct 1, 2021)

Funny conversation... just following the how-to in the FreeBSD Graphics wiki correctly, and OP won't have issues, IMHO.


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## Deleted member 30996 (Oct 4, 2021)

monwarez said:


> I don't understand why you give all this access to the operator group, you can easily delete an entire drive by using the raw access to the sata drives (and usb). I don't know for you, but when I am at my normal user I don't expect it to be able to delete everything.


What makes you think you can delete anything outside the home directory from the usr account with that file level of Satanic permission?

That same file with the name [devfsrules_common=7] at top which I carried over from my PC-BSD days as a beta tester in 2005 when I switched to FreeBSD in 2011 and been using since.

I can tell you. Because you have never ran a system that way and don't know what you can and cannot delete. Why don't I just delete that file from my user account if I can delete a whole drive. Right here, right now.

Whoopsie. You can't.

Well, then I'll delete the usb drive, since you said you can. Shoot the works!

Snake eyes! You lose again


I can't even mount a drive from my user account.


monwarez said:


> Same for video, there is a group that is created specifically for this task why not just add the user to the correct group ?


I got my start with BSD in 205 with PC-BSD, taught myself to use FreeBSD and ports and have been building my own desktops just like I laid out since coming here. I wrote that down as notes to myself so I wouldn't forget while offline and off-world.

I posted it here in 2017,  it has been featured twice in freebsdnews.com, DutchDaemon[ and SirDice both approved with my style of presentation found pleasing by DutchDaemon, what I remember and valued most as a writer.

It has been gone through with microscopic detail by untold squads of snipers who would love to find an error in point to be able to take me down with, but to no avail. I have taken suggestions offered to better it, have kept it updated, made an adaptation of the pf ruleseet for CUPS users in the same night requested going without sleep.

And just for teo who had to have some pretty icons on the fluxbox menu, added that. But busted himself as trolling when he admitted to not knowing frijoles from beans about it in the screenshot thread just the other day. 

We know how it played out from there.


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## astyle (Oct 4, 2021)

Trihexagonal said:


> I can't even mount a drive from my user account.


Funny you should say that, Trihexagonal ... I've been doing that in 13-RELEASE since day 1. It's quite workable in KDE on my machine. Not completely ironed out ( a USB stick shows up as /media-5843276584275985987/, or /media/6549827698543769/, but still very usable, no need to `su root` to mount a USB stick. I actually did not even do anything special with /etc/fstab or anything like that...


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## astyle (Oct 4, 2021)

Trihexagonal said:


> But busted himself as trolling when he admitted to not knowing frijoles from beans about it in the screenshot thread just the other day.


I eat *Phaseolus vulgaris* stuff every week, and love it!


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## astyle (Oct 4, 2021)

astyle said:


> Funny you should say that, Trihexagonal ... I've been doing that in 13-RELEASE since day 1. It's quite workable in KDE on my machine. Not completely ironed out ( a USB stick shows up as /media-5843276584275985987/, or /media/6549827698543769/, but still very usable, no need to `su root` to mount a USB stick. I actually did not even do anything special with /etc/fstab or anything like that...


Just remembered - I did have to install sysutils/fusefs-ntfs and to add `fusefs_load=YES` to /boot/loader.conf for my USB sticks to work. But nothing done beyond that.


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## monwarez (Oct 4, 2021)

Ok now can you do a `dd if=/dev/zero  of=/dev/da0` with a drive that you don't have a backup of the data (assuming it is an usb external that is named da0, rename with what you have), of course do not mount it. I am not interesting to test it myself since I care about my data. Your answer make no sense since I was talking about accessing the raw devices not the filesystem.


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## astyle (Oct 4, 2021)

monwarez said:


> Ok now can you do a `dd if=/dev/zero  of=/dev/da0` with a drive that you don't have a backup of the data (assuming it is an usb external that is named da0, rename with what you have), of course do not mount it. I am not interesting to test it myself since I care about my data. Your answer make no sense since I was talking about accessing the raw devices not the filesystem.


If the drive is not mounted, the `dd` command is not going to work, and the raw device cannot be accessed, either. Output from `dd` will be redirected to stderr(4) in that case.


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## Deleted member 30996 (Oct 5, 2021)

astyle said:


> Funny you should say that, [USERTrihexagonald=30996]Trihexagonal[/USER] ... I've been doing that in 13-RELEASE since day 1. It's quite workable in KDE on my machine. Not completely ironed out ( a USB stick shows up as /media-5843276584275985987/, or /media/6549827698543769/, but still very usable, no need to `su root` to mount a USB stick. I actually did not even do anything special with /etc/fstab or anything like that...


I didn't say I wanted it to mount. I do not want my usr account to  be able to mount a USB stick and have said so before. Now go ask Demonica to slap you.



monwarez said:


> Your answer make no sense since I was talking about accessing the raw devices not the filesystem.


I don't know how any of you graduated from college. You read at a 3rd grade level and revise to suit as you go. You were talking about it being able to delete "everything", But it could not delete anything.

At any rate, it's more BS I can do without and makes my point nicely.

I'm done answering your posts and all posts. I only responded on my way out to kick your dog because it was last in a line of garage about my tutorial.

 Which I already requested be deleted so somebody who knew what they were doing could write one.

So hop to it, chop chop. It's on you now.


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## SirDice (Oct 5, 2021)

It seems that a lot of you are overlooking the permissions, I noticed a lot of the devfs.rules everyone posted have 666 permissions. When you set 666 (-rw-rw-rw) permissions the group membership becomes irrelevant because "others" or "world" (in other words, everyone and everything) has write access.


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## Deleted member 30996 (Oct 5, 2021)

SirDice said:


> I noticed a lot of the devfs.rules everyone posted have 666 permissions.


That is the devs.rules file I brought with me and carried over from PC-BSD. That was their naming of it and what they're showing as "theirs" came from me.


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## grahamperrin@ (Oct 5, 2021)

SirDice said:


> It seems that a lot of you are overlooking the permissions,



Not overlooked by me, but thank you. I simply focused on group memberships.


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## grahamperrin@ (Nov 20, 2021)

Membership of the `video` group: clarification

With added emphasis:



> If your user isn't part of the video group you can't open the drm nodes in /dev/{drm,dri} and so it won't "work". Starting xorg might work but *starting anything wayland related will fail* as it requires a drm render node.
> 
> If you don't need/want hardware accelerated graphics there is no need to even use the `drm-kmod` modules.



– <https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=259048#c3>

For me, X.Org _does_ work without membership of the group – <https://forums.freebsd.org/posts/542927> – YMMV.


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## shkhln (Nov 21, 2021)

Clarification? This is a very simple matter, all drm related work is done with that assumption (video group membership). Whether anything works is not the point. The point is that your configuration is unsupported and can be broken at any moment without a warning.

(And, please, don't use that devs.rules config from PC-BSD. It's not a coincidence that project is dead — those guys _never_ had any idea what they were doing.)


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## grahamperrin@ (Nov 21, 2021)

With respect:



> … The point is that your configuration is unsupported …



– no, that was not the point.

The configuration was for test purposes, to help ascertain what works. It's quite unlike my everyday configuration.



> … please, don't use that devs.rules config from PC-BSD. …



Is what's below from PC-BSD? If so, I can't imagine how; there was a fresh installation of FreeBSD (without PC-BSD) long after I ceased using TrueOS.


```
% cat /etc/devfs.rules
[system=10]
add path 'usb/*' mode 0660 group operator
add path 'acd*' mode 0666
add path 'cd*' mode 0666
add path 'pass*' mode 0666
add path 'xpt*' mode 0666

%
```



> Clarification? This is a very simple matter, …



From what's linked below, and elsewhere, it seems that misunderstandings do occur.

Of course, I would like things to be simpler.

https://forums.freebsd.org/search/233542/?q=video&t=post&c[thread]=82392&o=date (it seems that I can not link this without breakage by XenForo).


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## shkhln (Nov 21, 2021)

It's usually more trouble than it's worth explaining precise permissions/kernel/driver interaction. I suspect with Radeon HD 7550M/7570M/7650M you are using https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Direct_Rendering_Infrastructure#DRI2 instead of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Direct_Rendering_Infrastructure#DRI3.


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## astyle (Nov 21, 2021)

shkhln said:


> (And, please, don't use that devs.rules config from PC-BSD. It's not a coincidence that project is dead — those guys _never_ had any idea what they were doing.)


Really? Dru Lavigne was one of the devs behind the PC-BSD project, same person is now running klarasystems.com. Dru has street cred by the truckload with other FreeBSD devs.


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## shkhln (Nov 21, 2021)

I'll make an exception and answer this. Sabina Anja and Allan Jude are running Klara. I have no idea if they employ Dru Lavigne or not. The rest of your claims are exactly as correct as this little fact.


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