# Need new laptop 11-13" i-series with Nvidia, suspend, wireless and lan support



## kreyszig (Jan 3, 2011)

Hi,

I am looking for a new laptop with Nvidia graphics and an 11-13" screen. My primary concern is to have suspend, wireless and LAN support on FreeBSD. Do you have any suggestion?

Thanks!


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## adamk (Jan 3, 2011)

Be vary wary of any new laptop with nvidia as they almost all support Optimus, which renders the nvidia GPU non-functional on both Linux and FreeBSD.

Adam


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## kreyszig (Jan 3, 2011)

adamk said:
			
		

> Be vary wary of any new laptop with nvidia as they almost all support Optimus, which renders the nvidia GPU non-functional on both Linux and FreeBSD.
> 
> Adam



I don't mind too much if I need to reboot the laptop to switch between the Intel chipset and the Nvidia chipset... Is that still an issue in this case? For example, the Lenovo T410s has a switch in the BIOS to select one GPU or the other I think?


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## adamk (Jan 3, 2011)

The idea behind Optimus is that you don't need to manually switch anything, it's handled automatically depending on the usage of the GPU.  As a result, the *vast* majority of Optimus laptops do not have that option in the BIOS.  Honestly, if it supports switchable graphics, I'd avoid buying it unless you actually see the option in the BIOS yourself.

http://nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=144750


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## kreyszig (Jan 3, 2011)

ok, so let say that I don't really need an Nvidia GPU on that laptop. What I really need though is to have support for 3D acceleration (for Compiz), an external monitor and be able to switch off the screen and the backlight.

Thanks


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## adamk (Jan 3, 2011)

OK, well in that case bear in mind that the latest Intel HD GPUs and the latest Radeon HD GPUs (HD5xxx and higher) have no acceleration under FreeBSD.


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## wblock@ (Jan 4, 2011)

kreyszig said:
			
		

> ok, so let say that I don't really need an Nvidia GPU on that laptop. What I really need though is to have support for 3D acceleration (for Compiz), an external monitor and be able to switch off the screen and the backlight.



Acers often have switchable backlights (Fn-F6), don't know if the newest models do.  xset(1) or other xorg utilities may do the job programmatically.

This is an example, but it's difficult to recommend without knowing exactly what it has for wireless and Ethernet.

The FreeBSD Laptop Compatibility List isn't responding, and hasn't for a couple of days...


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## kreyszig (Jan 4, 2011)

adamk said:
			
		

> OK, well in that case bear in mind that the latest Intel HD GPUs and the latest Radeon HD GPUs (HD5xxx and higher) have no acceleration under FreeBSD.



Is the Intel chipset GMA 5700MHD supported by FreeBSD? It seems to be supported by Ubuntu: http://www.system76.com/product_info.php?cPath=28&products_id=106


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## adamk (Jan 4, 2011)

According to the intel man page, the most recent chipset supported is the GM45, which is used in the GMA4500MHD.  I'm fairly certain the 5700MHD is too new.

Adam


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## adamk (Jan 4, 2011)

Here, take a look at this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel_GMA#Specifications

Anything that's Ironlake will have to use the vesa driver.

Adam

EDIT: And avoid the GMA500.  It's not even an intel GPU.


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## kreyszig (Jan 4, 2011)

Hmm,

if laptops with Nvidia cards and the ones with GMA500* GPUs are not supported, that pretty much means that no new intel-based laptop is supported by FreeBSD... Should it take long to add support for GMA500* chipsets to FreeBSD?


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## adamk (Jan 4, 2011)

kreyszig said:
			
		

> Hmm,
> 
> if laptops with Nvidia cards and the ones with GMA500* GPUs are not supported, that pretty much means that no new intel-based laptop is supported by FreeBSD...



And, since AMD HD5xxx and higher cards cards do not support acceleration, that eliminates all new AMD based laptops.  



> Should it take long to add support for GMA500* chipsets to FreeBSD?



It probably has the same basic requirements as drivers for the intel Ironlake and AMD HD5xxx+  cards, namely someone with enough time and knowledge to make it work.  Support for GMA500 (aka Poulsbo) may even require KMS, like Ironlake and AMD GPUs that are currently non-functional.  I can't be 100% sure, but that's the direction video drivers are going on linux.

Mind you, the HD5xxx cards from AMD will at least do 2D modesetting, and HD6xxx cards can also use the vesa driver.  But no newer intel or AMD GPU supports acceleration, and the nVidia mobile GPUs are all hit-or-miss, with miss becoming much more common.

I love FreeBSD, but if I were buying a new laptop, there's no way I'd currently consider FreeBSD on it, frankly.  I really hope the FreeBSD Foundation finds someone to get KMS usable on FreeBSD or the situation will only get worse quick.


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## DutchDaemon (Jan 5, 2011)

Saying that 'no nvidia cards are supported' is taking this a bit far. For example my HP Compaq with NVIDIA Quadro FX 570M works absolutely fine. You just have to make sure you know the exact type, and whether or not there are FreeBSD drivers for that type.


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## adamk (Jan 5, 2011)

Unfortunately, knowing the exact type also includes knowing if it's switchable and, if so, if there's a BIOS option to disable the Intel GPU.  Many times there's just no way of knowing that without actually looking in the BIOS.

Adam


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## paranormal (Jan 12, 2011)

*NVIDIA Quadro FX 570M*

You laptop sleep/resume well?
I have some Nvidia Card Quadro NVS 140M. And when I resume I see blank screen.
When nvidia.ko unloaded sleep/resume work fine...



			
				DutchDaemon said:
			
		

> Saying that 'no nvidia cards are supported' is taking this a bit far. For example my HP Compaq with NVIDIA Quadro FX 570M works absolutely fine. You just have to make sure you know the exact type, and whether or not there are FreeBSD drivers for that type.


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## DutchDaemon (Jan 12, 2011)

I have no interest in sleep/resume functions, so I don't know.


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## CalBear96 (Jan 18, 2011)

I just purchased a Clevo B5130 and it has the NVidia GT425M which supports optimus.  There is no BIOS option to switch off the iGPU, but that is fine as I don't need great graphics for my work side of the computer.  However, I am having serious issues getting Xorg to work.  Is FreeBSD and Xorg even operable under Optimus?  I would be very fine with relying on the Intel graphics.  It is the new Intel GMA HD graphics built onto the i7 640M CPU, which according to the post above is not supported.  Or can it run using the Vesa driver?


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## adamk (Jan 18, 2011)

I think the only way you will know if it works with the vesa driver (which is your only possible option) is to try it.  I'm going to guess "no" however.  I'd like to be proven wrong 

Adam


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## CalBear96 (Jan 19, 2011)

adamk said:
			
		

> I think the only way you will know if it works with the vesa driver (which is your only possible option) is to try it.  I'm going to guess "no" however.  I'd like to be proven wrong
> 
> Adam



I will do my best!  The Intel GMA HD works out of the box with Ubunutu, and the hybrid graphics do not pose a problem as long as you don't load the nVIdia driver.  Hopefully removing it or preventing the module from loading will work... assuming vesa works on this chip.  I will post back if I find success... or failure.


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## CalBear96 (Jan 19, 2011)

Good news!  The vesa driver works... kind of.  Right now I am stuck with 1280x1024 resolution on a FHD screen which look s really bad.  I tried to manipulate the settings but it does not work...yet.  But getting the /etc/X11/xorg.conf set was a pain, but it is done now.  Any ideas on a way to get 1920x1080 res out of vesa?
Here is the configuration I used.  I tried adding the 1920x1080 res in the display subsection and it did not work.

http://pastebin.com/n06K68A2


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## adamk (Jan 19, 2011)

I'm pretty sure you can't.  The vesa driver only supports vesa resolutions, I believe.

Adam


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## CalBear96 (Jan 19, 2011)

Then vesa needs to get with it and support 1920x1080.  The resolution that it has now looks awful.  lol


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## vermaden (Jan 19, 2011)

kreyszig said:
			
		

> My primary concern is to have suspend (...)



Does SUSPEND work on any laptop with FreeBSD?


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## adamk (Jan 19, 2011)

vermaden said:
			
		

> Does SUSPEND work on any laptop with FreeBSD?



Sure.  I've seen suspend work a lot on FreeBSD.  It's resume that's the tricky part 

Adam


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## adamk (Jan 19, 2011)

The vesa specification is very basic, and so is the driver.  It's designed to get people working with minimal graphics support.  Usually just long enough to install a driver native to the GPU.  It's certainly not intended for every day use.

Adam


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## CalBear96 (Jan 19, 2011)

adamk said:
			
		

> The vesa specification is very basic, and so is the driver.  It's designed to get people working with minimal graphics support.  Usually just long enough to install a driver native to the GPU.  It's certainly not intended for every day use.
> 
> Adam



That is unfortunate.  This Optimus enabled chip prevents me from using it in FreeBSD.  And as of now the Intel GMA HD igpu is not supported either.  Once it is, I will be fine.  I am actually googling it now to see if I can find any info about it and an ETA.


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## adamk (Jan 19, 2011)

Unfortunately, there is no ETA on it.  Before newer Intel GPUs can be supported, kernel modesetting has to be added to the FreeBSD DRM drivers.  Last I heard, the FreeBSD Foundation was looking for someone to work on it, but hadn't found anyone yet.

ADam


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## CalBear96 (Jan 19, 2011)

I just read that Intel released a legacy driver back in August that allows UMS without the need for GEM/KMS.  it was designed to help the Linux users with older i8** chipsets.  Now I just need to find it and see if I can get it to work. Here is the link:

http://cgit.freedesktop.org/~ickle/xf86-video-intel/commit/?h=legacy


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## adamk (Jan 19, 2011)

While I could be wrong about this, I don't think it will do you much good since the work was geared specifically at the older GPUs, and you're using the latest cutting edge GPU from Intel.  Let us know how you make out.

Adam


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## CalBear96 (Jan 19, 2011)

i thought that too, but the mailing list message from Kris Moore of PC-BSD gives me hope.  I am going to try it right after I finally eat something today.  Amazing how time flies while having your nose buried in a computer.  lol

Quick question... I did not find it in the ports, so I will download it from this site.  Do I need to do anything special to get it to load?  Should I get rid of the current intel driver first?


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## CalBear96 (Jan 20, 2011)

I have downloaded the zip file of the legacy driver.  How do I install the driver from here?  I have only installed ports.  Should I also delete the current intel driver so there is no confusion?


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## adamk (Jan 20, 2011)

Yes, I would uninstall the driver from ports.

Usually installing a xorg video driver outside of the ports tree is something along the lines of:


```
tar xzvf xf86-video-intel-blahblahblah.tgz
cd xf86-video-intel-blahblahblah
./configure --prefix=/usr/local --with-xorg-module-dir=/usr/local/lib/xorg/modules
make
make install
```


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## CalBear96 (Jan 20, 2011)

I am sorry for being so dense.  I am getting stuck after changing directories.  The configuration is stumping me.  `./configure` is an unknown command.


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## adamk (Jan 20, 2011)

"configure" doesn't exist in the new directory?  If not, how about "autogen.sh"?  If that exists, run it instead.

Adam


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## CalBear96 (Jan 20, 2011)

I need xorg macros of v1.8 or higher but I have 1.6.0.  Where can I update those?  Because of that I got a "fail" status.


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## adamk (Jan 20, 2011)

http://cgit.freedesktop.org/xorg/util/macros/snapshot/util-macros-1.8.0.tar.gz

Process is pretty much the same, though you won't need the --with-xorg-module-dir option (and it will probably error out if you use it).

Adam


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## CalBear96 (Jan 20, 2011)

Ok thank you.  And I actually type out "--with-xorg-moduleblahblahblah?" on the previous one or just `./autogen.sh /usr/local/lib/xorg/modules`

Dave


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## adamk (Jan 20, 2011)

When doing the macros, just [cmd=""]./autogen.sh --prefix=/usr/local[/cmd] should work.  When doing the driver, use the command I gave in the directions above, but just replace ./configure with ./autogen.sh.  The rest of the command would stay the same.

Adam


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## CalBear96 (Jan 20, 2011)

Trap 9 kernel dump and reboot on the "autogen" with the intel driver.  Perhaps that was the latter code you had mentioned that caused it to error out?


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## adamk (Jan 20, 2011)

Could be... Maybe...  Perhaps 

You actually got it to compile and tried using it.  You already know more about this updated UMS driver than I do 

Adam


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## CalBear96 (Jan 20, 2011)

I reran it without the latter portion and it configured up until I got this

```
configure: error: cannot run /usr/local/bin/bash ./config.sub
```

I am unable to "make" it at this point.  Argh.  I would really like to figure this thing out, so that with A LOT of your help, I will have actually made a contribution to the FreeBSD community.


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## CalBear96 (Jan 20, 2011)

It looks like this driver might need to run from a prior version of X server.  I think until this issue gets resolved, I will just switch back to Linux for my laptop.  The legacy driver also does not support acceleration of any type 2D or 3D, so it really is a waste of system resources.  But I have learned so much so far, so I am going to make a gateway/server and it will run FreeBSD.  The architecture on my old desktop is perfect for FreeBSD, though I may need to add a bit of RAM.  Thank you for your patience and all your help.  
Dave


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## dusty_fox (Apr 22, 2011)

adamk said:
			
		

> Sure.  I've seen suspend work a lot on FreeBSD.  It's resume that's the tricky part
> 
> Adam



I would love to be able to use FreeBSD on my systems, but this issue pretty much kills it for me.  Laptop+nvidia+resume do not play well together.


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