# I'm looking for a good USB controller 3.0,4 ports,self powered compatible with FreeBSD....



## ziomario (Dec 13, 2021)

Hello.

can someone suggest to me a good USB 3.0 controller compatible with FreeBSD that 's also self powered and that has at least 4 USB ports ? I wanna use it for making a better distribution of my USB disks between the bhyve VMS that I use eveyrday. Very thanks.


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## Geezer (Dec 13, 2021)

I got one that failed dismally, and one that is great.

The one that works has NEC D720201 which seems to be supported in FreeBSD. It is self powered. The main reason I got it was that it was the only controller I found with a heatsink.


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## ziomario (Dec 13, 2021)

where did you buy it ? I'm having some troubles to find it. It seems available only on aliexpress. But,unfortunately :

We are sorry to inform you that as we are now still affected by      the COVID-19 which we cannot control,  the flight schedule to Italy was suspended by airline, we can only      ship the parcel to your country by sea (that is surface parcel),      it will take around 60 days to arrive your country.


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## Phishfry (Dec 13, 2021)

Don't you have local craigslist or computer flea markets there?
Used is fine. Buy 3 and I bet 2 work on FreeBSD.

Via USB Chip (as stated in other thread) works good.
NEC USB Chip works good.

Look for used HP and Dell USB3 PCIe cards. They are real cheap and popular.


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## ziomario (Dec 13, 2021)

No. Here I live in a place with a very low level knowledge about computers. The local resellers are dead here. They sell only PC with Windows inside and every hardware component is already chosen and cannot be changed. Very few guys knows what is Linux. U can imagine how many guys knows FreeBSD. I would like to have the exact websites where I can buy. And...I'm in love with the fovore NEC D720201 self powered + heatsink model.


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## Phishfry (Dec 13, 2021)

Once you tried deluxe you never wanna experiment again.


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## covacat (Dec 13, 2021)

Amazon.it : NEC D720201


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## ziomario (Dec 13, 2021)

Phishfry said:


> Once you tried deluxe you never wanna experiment again.



hahahahahahaha. are u talking about the fovore NEC D720201 self powered + heatsink model ? or about FreeBSD in general as a good OS ?


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## shkhln (Dec 13, 2021)

There is no such thing as self-powered (what would that be, RTG?) PCI cards. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PCI_Express#Power. Are your disks able to work on 10 W total?


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## Phishfry (Dec 13, 2021)

Deluxe as in $100 card that serves 4 client VM's.








						ASMedia USB controller 3.1 cannot be masked by bhyve ?
					

Hello to everyone. I've bought a new USB 3.1 controller from the company "ASMedia Technology Inc.",this model :  https://www.xt-xinte.com/h-product-detail.html?goods_id=682689    and I tried to mask it with bhyve because I want to pass thru it inside a virtual machine. This is how I have...




					forums.freebsd.org


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## ziomario (Dec 13, 2021)

You don't want to help me or what ? you gave to me a very general website with a lot of USB controllers that aren't good. Why do u want to waste your and my time ? The controllers in that page are missing some of the features I would like to have. they aren't self powered or they haven't the heatsink or they haven't a good or known chip like the renesas.


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## Phishfry (Dec 13, 2021)

I think he means bus powered.


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## Phishfry (Dec 13, 2021)

Heatsink is marketing gimmick on USB card.


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## shkhln (Dec 13, 2021)

ziomario said:


> You don't want to help me or what ? you gave to me a very general website with a lot of USB controllers that aren't good. Why do u want to waste your and my time ? The controllers in that page are missing some of the features I would like to have. they aren't self powered or they haven't the heatsink or they haven't a good or known chip like the renesas.


These peripherals aren't particularly profitable, so the dodgy ones are pretty much all that exists.


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## ziomario (Dec 13, 2021)

The Dell OEM card - Renesys USB3 with two ports is not good. two ports for me aren't enough. I have a lot of USB devices to attach to it. I prefer 4 ports and the Dell Dual Port USB 3.0 PCI Express Card Low Profile P/N:0FWGJ8 is too much expensive.


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## Phishfry (Dec 13, 2021)

I know. That is just a general nudge. 2 ports was fine to start with for me.
Like shkhln mentions. There is some junk on the market.
So Dell and HP and IBM don't generally buy junk. So their OEM cards are OK in my book.
I am sure they make 4 ports versions. Look around...


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## ziomario (Dec 13, 2021)

what do u think about this ? 



			FebSmart
		


price is low,it has 4 ports and it is powered by the bus. Do u think that it is freebsd compatible ?


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## Phishfry (Dec 13, 2021)

What is the USB chipset? I can't zoom in on the pictures. Details is everything.
This is better than the 5 port card in the other thread.
The 'extra chip' worries me.


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## ziomario (Dec 13, 2021)

Renesas. 


        3. Based on RENESAS NEC high performance chipset with more advance technology.4X added power module provide 4X2 ampere current ensure adequate power supply for USB device.4X electric circuit protector and voltage stable capacitance protect data safety than ever.


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## Phishfry (Dec 13, 2021)

x4 PCI bus is better. That 5 port card with x1 PCIe lanes is way underprovisioned. Even on PCIe v3
I would say you have a contender with this card.


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## Phishfry (Dec 13, 2021)

Even this card only has x1 lane PCIe(2.0) and it has to deleiver 4 USB ports at 5gigabits/sec.
Ummmm...Houston we have a problem.
PCIe 2.0 at x1 lanes gives you 500 Megabytes a second
5 gigabits a second is 640 Megabytes a second.

So one USB3 port could soak your PCIe x1 bus.


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## ziomario (Dec 13, 2021)

its not good.


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## Phishfry (Dec 13, 2021)

It makes sense why Dell/HP/IBM cards only have 2 ports.
That is maxing the PCIe 2.0 slot out.
But they needed to add flexibility because people want more ports.


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## ziomario (Dec 13, 2021)

I think that I will buy another of this :






						SEDNA - PCI Express 4 Port (4E) USB 3.0 Adapter - with Low Profile Bracket - (NEC/Renesas uPD720201 chipset): Amazon.co.uk: Computers & Accessories
					

Buy



					www.amazon.co.uk
				




I have already one and it works great. I think that these boards needs to get an extra powerage. For this reason the models that are powered only by the bus aren't good.


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## gpw928 (Dec 13, 2021)

I used a StarTech 2xport USB 3.1Gen2 PCIe card on my old ZFS server motherboard.  It's a PCI Express x4 card  -- chosen carefully to provide the bandwidth I wanted.

StarTech have a variety of USB 3.0 PCIe cards available, with a variety of bandwidth options.

My personal experience of StarTech is very positive.  I have found their products to work well with FreeBSD and their online support to be excellent.  At this very moment I am using two of their SATA/USB converters to vacate my ZFS tank to an external 2x12TB spindle ZFS mirror.

Always check the USB3 standard in the technical specifications, and look for USB 3.1Gen2 or USB3.2 Gen2.


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## gpw928 (Dec 13, 2021)

ziomario said:


> I think that I will buy another of this :
> 
> 
> 
> ...


As Phishfry observed, the PCIE 2.0 x1 slot has limited bandwidth, and the tech specs on the SENDA card you mention specify "Single-lane (x1) PCI Express Throughput Rates Up to 4.8Gbps".  That's not a lot of bandwidth for 4 x USB 3.0 ports (SATA disks are generally rated at 6.0 Gbps _*each*_).


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## astyle (Dec 13, 2021)

If OP can get stuff from amazon.co.uk, that's probably his best bet. I didn't have a good experience with aliexpress (bought a wi-fi card for my previous laptop, only to discover that they shipped the wrong brand).  And - go with established brand names. For compatibility with FreeBSD - these forums are a decent place to ask, they will point to the hardware notes that the FreeBSD project maintains. Established names, brand-new (not second-hand) are frankly a good bet. Yeah, you pay a bit more, but peace of mind is priceless, IMHO.


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## Geezer (Dec 14, 2021)

Phishfry said:


> I think he means bus powered.



No. Mine has got its own fusion reactor.



Phishfry said:


> Heatsink is marketing gimmick on USB card.



Hence the need for a heatsink.


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## ziomario (Dec 14, 2021)

I can buy on Amazon.com. I do this frequently. So,if someone can share the link where I can get a good USB controller that hasn't any PCIE 2.0 x1 slot,he will make me happy


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## astyle (Dec 14, 2021)

ziomario said:


> I can buy on Amazon.com. I do this frequently. So,if someone can share the link where I can get a good USB controller that hasn't any PCIE 2.0 x1 slot,he will make me happy


If you want PICe 3.0 or 4.0, just type the term into the search bar of Amazon. Amazon is prone to having search results polluted by sellers who pay more to have their wares float to the top - but persistence pays off. Play with your search terms until you find what you need - I do that for my purchases.


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## ziomario (Dec 14, 2021)

astyle said:


> If you want PICe 3.0 or 4.0, just type the term into the search bar of Amazon. Amazon is prone to having search results polluted by sellers who pay more to have their wares float to the top - but persistence pays off. Play with your search terms until you find what you need - I do that for my purchases.



Man,I don't stay with my hands in my hand. I'm doing that already,but I didn't find anything good right now.


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## covacat (Dec 14, 2021)

https://amazon.it/Inateck-RedComets-U21-Scheda-Larghezza/dp/B08M5YHWFD/
		

think it has a via chipset


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## ziomario (Dec 14, 2021)

FreeBSD may not work well with USB 3.1,as someone doubted yesterday in a post correlated to this. So,if it may not support USB 3.1,could it supports 3.2?

here :









						ASMedia USB controller 3.1 cannot be masked by bhyve ?
					

Hello to everyone. I've bought a new USB 3.1 controller from the company "ASMedia Technology Inc.",this model :  https://www.xt-xinte.com/h-product-detail.html?goods_id=682689    and I tried to mask it with bhyve because I want to pass thru it inside a virtual machine. This is how I have...




					forums.freebsd.org


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## astyle (Dec 14, 2021)

Try this search term: "usb 3.0 pcie expansion card" (w/o the quotes). One good example (I'm based in US): https://www.amazon.com/Tiergrade-Superspeed-Expasion-15-Pin-Connector/dp/B07Z34BJYH/ref=sr_1_3?crid=1U9EOCFSIAI7&keywords=usb+3.0+pcie+expansion+card&qid=1639496076&sprefix=usb+3.0+pcie,aps,277&sr=8-3 If I were to buy that, I would have confidence it would be compatible with FreeBSD (My install has 13-RELEASE).

What covacat gave you is an Italian Sausage 
(In US, 'links' also means 'sausage')


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## gpw928 (Dec 14, 2021)

The terms USB 3.1 and USB 3.2 are pretty meaningless without adding the Generation number.

As I suggested above, you probably want to stick to USB 3.1 Gen 2, and USB 3.2 Gen 2 (the latter is faster, and less common, but the two standards are compatible).  These specifications need to be matched between your USB disks and the PCIe card.

I suggest that you address the issues one at a time:

What is your final disk configuration?  Are you using RAID of any kind?  Is redundancy important?  Is performance important?  Or do you just want low cost?
What is the maximum power consumption of each USB disk?  You need to match this to the wattage available on each USB port.  If those data are not on the manufacturers' technical specification sheets, you need to contact their technical support, and find out.  By doing this, you also test their service capability.  
What version PCIe bus do you have on the motherboard?  The most common answer is 3.0, but could be anything from 1 to 5.  This will determine some bandwidth limitations. 
How many free PCIe slots are there on your motherboard, and how many lanes do each of them have (look at what's actually installed, and the diagrams in the motherboard manual).
For optimum price, performance, and redundancy of four USB disks I would choose two dual port 4-lane (x4) PCIe cards, but they still need to fit into the motherboard (two x4 slots required).  As I indicated above, I have tested the StarTech PEXUSB312A2 card on FreeBSD and it worked well.  If PCIe x4 slots are at a premium, you can pay more and get something with 4 USB ports on a single card that would probably work well.  Note the option for separate power supply to the 4-port card providing for up to 900mA (4.5W at 5V) per USB port.  Most USB ports can supply 2.5W at best...

StarTech USB 3 cards are very widely available.  You just have to use search engines.  That includes the ones on Amazon and Google.


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## ziomario (Mar 8, 2022)

What USB controller do u you suggest to me to buy between these? What's better?

https://www.amazon.com/Inateck-Express-15-Pin-Connector-KT4001/dp/B00B6ZCNGM

https://www.amazon.com/Tiergrade-Superspeed-Expasion-15-Pin-Connector/dp/B07Z34BJYH


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## astyle (Mar 8, 2022)

ziomario said:


> what USB controller do u suggest to me to buy between these ? what's better ?
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/Inateck-Express-15-Pin-Connector-KT4001/dp/B00B6ZCNGM
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/Tiergrade-Superspeed-Expasion-15-Pin-Connector/dp/B07Z34BJYH


I think that either one would work. With stuff like that, it usually comes down to brand preferences (I've had some Intel-branded stuff that turned out to be duds).


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## eternal_noob (Mar 8, 2022)

I don't know how's the law in Italy but here in Germany we can send back stuff we ordered on the Internet within two weeks without any reason and get our money back.
If this applies to Italy as well, i'd order both and test the hell out of them. Then send the one back you don't like.


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## astyle (Mar 8, 2022)

eternal_noob said:


> I don't know how's the law in Italy but here in Germany we can send back stuff we ordered on the Internet within two weeks without any reason and get our money back.
> If this applies to Italy as well, i'd order both and test the hell out of them. Then send the one back you don't like.


Didn't know there's such a law in Germany... in US, it's standard business practice to give a week or two for "No questions asked" returns (although on Amazon, that practice has suffered a lot of abuse from customers who buy clothes just to wear to a party). I'd rather do my homework, find what I want, and then not fuss with sending it back. After all, you still gotta package it properly for shipping it back, and that is an effort I'm too lazy for.


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## eternal_noob (Mar 8, 2022)

astyle said:


> I'd rather do my homework, find what I want, and then not fuss with sending it back. After all, you still gotta package it properly for shipping it back, and that is an effort I'm too lazy for.


Not to mention the additional pollution you'd cause.



astyle said:


> Didn't know there's such a law in Germany


It's called Fernabsatzgesetz == Distance Selling Law


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## ziomario (Mar 8, 2022)

eternal_noob said:


> I don't know how's the law in Italy but here in Germany we can send back stuff we ordered on the Internet within two weeks without any reason and get our money back.
> If this applies to Italy as well, i'd order both and test the hell out of them. Then send the one back you don't like.



Never did that. I don't like to "play" with returns.


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## ziomario (Mar 8, 2022)

astyle said:


> Didn't know there's such a law in Germany... in US, it's standard business practice to give a week or two for "No questions asked" returns (although on Amazon, that practice has suffered a lot of abuse from customers who buy clothes just to wear to a party). I'd rather do my homework, find what I want, and then not fuss with sending it back. After all, you still gotta package it properly for shipping it back, and that is an effort I'm too lazy for.



Exactly. In addition im not vaccinated. I can't go all around the city because I don't have the green cazz. People like me can only go to some few specific places,like pharmacies, hospitals, supermarkets. stop.


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## astyle (Mar 8, 2022)

Still not vaxxed? Consider this: If you wear a boxing glove to punch a bag, you can still end up with bloody knuckles. But without the glove, your entire hand will be crushed, bones, muscles and everything. Getting vaxxed is like putting on boxing gloves - yeah, there's some protection for you, and it's much better than nothing. Boxing gloves are required equipment to participate in the sport, vaccination is required to participate in person-to-person interaction. FWIW, boxers are supposed to be vaccinated to fight anywhere on this planet. So, just take it on the chin, and go get it.


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## Geezer (Mar 9, 2022)

[ redshift ] [ redshift ] [ redshift ] [ redshift ]


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## ziomario (Mar 9, 2022)

astyle said:


> Still not vaxxed? Consider this: If you wear a boxing glove to punch a bag, you can still end up with bloody knuckles. But without the glove, your entire hand will be crushed, bones, muscles and everything. Getting vaxxed is like putting on boxing gloves - yeah, there's some protection for you, and it's much better than nothing. Boxing gloves are required equipment to participate in the sport, vaccination is required to participate in person-to-person interaction. FWIW, boxers are supposed to be vaccinated to fight anywhere on this planet. So, just take it on the chin, and go get it.



but I don't have so much relationships with other people,so I don't need it. and for the very few ones I have,I keep the distance and I wear a strong mask. I'm scared by the bad side effects of the vaccination. It's a stronger fear than the fear to get the covid. so...


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## SirDice (Mar 9, 2022)

ziomario said:


> I'm scared by the bad side effects of the vaccination.


Close to 11 billion doses have been given world-wide and nothing major has happened. Only an extremely small portion of the population have had any adverse side-effects. And most of those have only been temporary. 


ziomario said:


> It's a stronger fear than the fear to get the covid.


Rational fear is fine, irrational fear however is not. You have an irrational fear.


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## gpw928 (Mar 10, 2022)

Making a rational decision means that you have to sensibly evaluate the risks -- or at least obtain your information from sensible sources.

Vaccines have a tiny risk.  So does breathing.  Both have considerable benefits.  But when you get a vaccine, the benefits accrue to yourself AND those around you.

“More people are killed every year by pigs than by sharks, which shows you how good we are at evaluating risk.”  -- Bruce Schneier


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## Geezer (Mar 10, 2022)

[ redshift ] [ redshift ] [ redshift ] [ redshift ]


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## Profighost (Mar 10, 2022)

I have good experiences with cards by DeLock


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## ziomario (Mar 11, 2022)

I've bought this cheap card model :

https://www.amazon.it/gp/product/B00B6ZCNGM/?th=1

I haven't still tested it. Regarding the vaccination and the covid : I agree with you,the risk of a bad side effect is tiny,but I don't want to take it. If the risk is tiny,some of the effects can have a very bad impact on health : I’m talking about blood coagulation problems, neurological problems, immune system failure, heart problems. No,thanks.


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## Phishfry (Mar 11, 2022)

So 4 USB3.0 ports all fed by x1 Lane of PCIe.
Ridiculously underprovisioned.
Next post will be, Why is my USB3 so slow....


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## SirDice (Mar 11, 2022)

ziomario said:


> Regarding the vaccination and the covid : I agree with you,the risk of a bad side effect is tiny,but I don't want to take it. If the risk is tiny,some of the effects can have a very bad impact on health : I’m talking about blood coagulation problems, neurological problems, immune system failure, heart problems. No,thanks.


The risks of those effects are much, much larger if you get infected. Yes, you're staying out of the wind right now by staying at home. But there will come a time when all the restrictions are lifted and SARS-CoV-2 will be endemic. That's when _you_ will get infected. And you will have NO protection whatsoever. No, Omicron isn't "mild" (It's only mild for people who've been vaccinated). It's milder than Delta, yes, but Omicron has about the same potency as Alpha, the first strain that started this whole ordeal. Talk to a real doctor and get yourself vaccinated. Seriously.


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## ziomario (Mar 11, 2022)

Phishfry said:


> So 4 USB3.0 ports all fed by x1 Lane of PCIe.
> Ridiculously underprovisioned.
> Next post will be, Why is my USB3 so slow....



what we want to have for 20 dollars ?


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## ziomario (Mar 11, 2022)

SirDice said:


> The risks of those effects are much, much larger if you get infected. Yes, you're staying out of the wind right now by staying at home. But there will come a time when all the restrictions are lifted and SARS-CoV-2 will be endemic. That's when _you_ will get infected. And you will have NO protection whatsoever. No, Omicron isn't "mild" (It's only mild for people who've been vaccinated). It's milder than Delta, yes, but Omicron has about the same potency as Alpha, the first strain that started this whole ordeal. Talk to a real doctor and get yourself vaccinated. Seriously.



I will never have a lot of interactions with people. I never had them. I'm an introverted person who always goes with a few people and rarely goes out of my home. And I'm retired.


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## grahamperrin@ (Mar 11, 2022)

ziomario said:


> I've bought this cheap card model :
> 
> https://www.amazon.it/gp/product/B00B6ZCNGM/?th=1
> 
> I haven't still tested it.



Amazon.com: Inateck PCI-e to USB 3.0 (4 Ports) PCI Express Card and 15-Pin Power Connector, Red (KT4001) : Electronics

KT4001 / KTU3FR-4P amongst the relatively inexpensive cards at <https://www.inateck.com/collections/pcie-card/others>



Phishfry said:


> So 4 USB3.0 ports all fed by x1 Lane of PCIe.
> Ridiculously underprovisioned. 𡀦…



Are these any better? <https://www.inateck.com/collections/pcie-card/redcomets-series> (The site seems to be flaky at the moment, maybe it will be better later.)


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## SirDice (Mar 11, 2022)

ziomario said:


> I'm an introverted person who always goes with a few people and rarely goes out.


It only takes one person. Heck, that person doesn't even need to be in the same room as you. It's an airborne virus. Those aerosols tend to hang around for a while in a badly ventilated room. You going into that room _after_ an infected person spent some time in there will almost certainly get you infected too.


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## ziomario (Mar 11, 2022)

grahamperrin said:


> Amazon.com: Inateck PCI-e to USB 3.0 (4 Ports) PCI Express Card and 15-Pin Power Connector, Red (KT4001) : Electronics
> 
> KT4001 / KTU3FR-4P amongst the relatively inexpensive cards at <https://www.inateck.com/collections/pcie-card/others>
> 
> ...



yes. I've already saw the red  comet some time ago. it costs 50 dollars. It's too expensive for me. I dropped it and I've bought the KTU3FR-4P model.


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## grahamperrin@ (Mar 11, 2022)

ziomario said:


> In addition



For *all* the non-technical discussion, from various people, that's entirely unrelated to FreeBSD and hardware, I suggest:

<https://old.reddit.com/r/COVID19/> – <https://www.reddit.com/r/COVID19/wiki/rules>

Please!


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## Phishfry (Mar 11, 2022)

I thought we established in another thread that 2 USB 3.0 ports needs more than x1 PCIe lane. Even with PCIe 3.0 lanes.



> The theoretical transfer speed of USB 3.0 is 4.8 Gbit/s (600MBps) <<<< This is only one port





> PCIe 3.0 x1 Lane Throughput= 0.985 GB/s (985MBps)



So for summary with this card you need 2400MBps and you are giving it 1000MBps with x1 Lanes.
All of these are max theoretical but 2.4 into 1 is pretty easy problem to recognize.


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## ziomario (Mar 11, 2022)

Would someone make a donation for a poor guy like me,who loves so much FreeBSD and that he wants to test always almost everything on this wonderful OS ? thanks


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## astyle (Mar 11, 2022)

ziomario said:


> I will never have a lot of interactions with people. I never had them. I'm an introverted person who always goes with a few people and rarely goes out of my home. And I'm retired.


Your demographics are at a much higher risk of getting adverse effects if they're not vaccinated. This is why they get *prioritized* for vaccination.


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## ziomario (Mar 11, 2022)

we can't talk about this argument here. it is out of topic.


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## astyle (Mar 11, 2022)

I remember posting in another thread awhile ago, which also encouraged ziomario to get vaccinated. I also remember saying that this is a matter serious enough that it takes precedence over technical discussions. Unfortunately, another mod (not SirDice ) deleted those posts before SirDice essentially agreed with my point.


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## SirDice (Mar 11, 2022)

ziomario said:


> we can't talk about this argument here


You're the one that brought it up.


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## eternal_noob (Mar 11, 2022)

astyle said:


> I also remember saying that this is a matter serious enough that it takes precedence over technical discussions.


I say this is a highly personal decision and we should not try to convince him.

That said, i think talking about Covid or vaccines should be considered political, therefore not allowed here.


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## astyle (Mar 11, 2022)

eternal_noob said:


> I say this is a highly personal decision and we should not try to convince him.
> 
> That said, i think talking about Covid or vaccines should be considered political, therefore not allowed here.


I disagree on this being a highly personal issue:









						FreeBSD forums and privacy
					

They'll never take me alive. I haven't had one.   That's what they want to make you think.




					forums.freebsd.org
				




Why did he bring it up, in a place as public as FreeBSD forums,  in the first place, if it's something that personal? Gotta have some judgement about what you actually share on the Internet.

What me and SirDice are saying - I see that as part of the backdrop against which to consider the very idea of the vaccination push.


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## eternal_noob (Mar 11, 2022)

astyle said:


> Basically, walking around unvaccinated is akin to walking around with a loaded gun with the safety off - a danger to yourself and others.


Not true with Omicron anymore.

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1501933905158410249_View: https://twitter.com/FinancialTimes/status/1501933905158410249_


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## astyle (Mar 11, 2022)

The very tweet you shared, eternal_noob says:


> But, there are caveats.


The very statistics you quote - Academically valid statistical analysis would provide truckloads of reasons to vaccinate, and not fuss about the non-zero chance of bad side effects, which is what me and SirDice are saying.


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## eternal_noob (Mar 11, 2022)

I agree that getting vaxxed protects yourself (sometimes, depending on a lot of factors). But not others.
That's why i say it's a highly personal issue.


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## astyle (Mar 11, 2022)

eternal_noob said:


> I agree that getting vaxxed protects yourself (sometimes, depending on a lot of factors). But not others.
> That's why i say it's a highly personal issue.


Unfortunately, that's a Composition Division logical reasoning error...






						Fallacy of composition - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org


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## eternal_noob (Mar 11, 2022)

My last statement on that topic:



> A week after the end of the festival, Cologne is seeing a sharp rise in the seven-day incidence rate of COVID infections — 56% higher than the national average.
> ...
> The country's 2G+ rule, which requires a booster vaccination, double vaccination or proof of recovery along with a negative COVID test, was enforced.











						Carnival spread COVID in Germany — again – DW – 03/08/2022
					

The German city of Cologne’s Carnival celebrations raged on as normal late last month, barring a few restrictions. Now the city at the heart of the holiday is facing COVID-19 consequences.




					www.dw.com
				




Being vaxxed does not mean you can't
a. get it
b. spread it

Over and out.


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## SirDice (Mar 11, 2022)

eternal_noob said:


> Being vaxxed does not mean you can't
> a. get it
> b. spread it


Yes, breakthrough infections can still happen (there is no 100% protection, no vaccine ever did). Yes, you are infectious when that happens. But both the risk of getting a breakthrough infection and the viral load when you are infectious are significantly reduced. You are also infectious for a shorter amount of time, reducing the overall viral load even more.








						Coronavirus Disease 2019
					

CDC provides credible COVID-19 health information to the U.S.




					www.cdc.gov
				




Because vaccinations never give 100% protection you need to combine a good vaccination strategy with other mitigating factors, like masks, social distancing, etc. You're not going to defeat SARS-CoV-2 with vaccinations alone.

Just like protecting your computers and networks isn't based solely on having a virusscanner installed. You take a layered approach. Firewalls, hardening, code audits, etc. are all part of the overall protection. And still networks and computers get infected. Funny how protecting from a computer "virus" works similar to protection against a real one.


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## eternal_noob (Mar 11, 2022)

You are linking to an ancient article which does not apply to Omicron. Things have changed since. See the Cologne incident.
All vaxxed, boostered and tested. Nothing was significantly reduced.

Other than this, i agree.

Don't get me wrong. I am pro vaxx but i think with Omicron this became a very personal issue.


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## astyle (Mar 11, 2022)

(A counted infection incident) != (infection incident with severe consequences). Thanks to the fact that most were vaxxed, no deaths were recorded as fallout of that festival.


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## Vull (Mar 11, 2022)

eternal_noob said:


> I agree that getting vaxxed protects yourself (sometimes, depending on a lot of factors). But not others.
> That's why i say it's a highly personal issue.


Verily


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## eternal_noob (Mar 11, 2022)

astyle said:


> Thanks to the fact that most were vaxxed


All were vaxxed. The unvaccinated were not allowed.


astyle said:


> Thanks to the fact that most were vaxxed, no deaths were recorded as fallout of that festival.


This and the fact that Omicron is now less deadly than the flu. (See the Twitter thread i linked to.)


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## ziomario (Mar 11, 2022)

SirDice said:


> You're the one that brought it up.



Not exactly. My will was to explain the reasons why I don't like to buy and then make returns to the online shops and I was forced to include the Covid among the reasons because my freedom is limited 'cause it. But I don't want to talk about covid and I don't want to do it in the wrong thread.


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## grahamperrin@ (Mar 12, 2022)

Ignore / Filter System
					

This is from one of my older posts, but it was several different ideas, and I rather this one be added rather then any of the others.  Ignore/Filter System One thing I've noticed that is currently lacking (In the form of user ignore) currently, and that most forums do not extend more then the...




					xenforo.com
				




… and, I'm gone before page 4.


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