# Bying new Desktop PC for the living room.



## Alain De Vos (Jul 7, 2021)

If you would buy today a new PC for your livingroom.
Which brand/vendor would you take and why ?
Would you use NVME ?
AMD, Intel or ARM  (for it's low power consumption) ?
What do you like about your current desktop / keyboard / monitor setup ?
Which feature you like, you find too pricy ?
[I would at least have the requirement for at least two network connections ...]


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## richardtoohey2 (Jul 7, 2021)

You've missed out what it's for ... Gaming?  Media?  Audio?  Video?  Firewall?

Had good experiences with NVME so far (all Samsung).

Two network connections - so one wired and one wireless?  Or both wired?


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## mer (Jul 7, 2021)

Depends on the intended use.  If basically "a PC that everyone in the family or even guests could use to do homework, check email, look up food recipes, watch some you tubes", I'd look at a NUC formfactor.
They are limited expansion, but I've got one that runs FreeBSD just dandy.  In fact, it's the system I'm on now.
It's got a few USB3 ports, onboard ethernet (intel with em0), has onboard wireless, Intel CPU (i915 graphics).
Looks like a big heatsink.  Drives a  2560x1440 pixels monitor at 32bit depth, 16G RAM, Samsung SSD 850 EVO mSATA 250GB for storage.  Generic USB keyboard and mouse.

Works nicely for daily driver fast enough for me video works good enough (I'm not a gamer, most of the videos are chainsaw related.  Fun watching a big tree fall in the right direction).

If I were to start over, I'd probably just by NUC formfactor stuff and a big enough NAS for everybody's storage.


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## TerabyteForever (Jul 7, 2021)

I'd buy a small, Mac Mini like thing. I'm using a Lenovo ThinkCentre as a daily driver and I definitely recommend you to check it out.


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## Phishfry (Jul 7, 2021)

The terms in your title are confusing.
Desktop PC in Living Room?
Usually a Living Room has big screen TV and a HTPC.
What are you shopping for? A desktop PC or a HTPC.




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## Alain De Vos (Jul 7, 2021)

I'm more in the process of collecting information in order to create an idea what would be a good choice and for which reason and at which time. taking into account budgetary evaluation . PS: There is or was also mini-itx.
I like PC's without ventilators, and rigid keyboards which gamers use, and who don't collect dust inside, and monitors with 5-4 ratio.


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## scottro (Jul 8, 2021)

Well, one piece of information I can share, don't know if it's useful to you. But I used to use cherry blue switches. Then, one night, after probably close to a year, my wife noticed its clickiness and after that, couldn't unhear it. I tried browns and reds, but they still bothered her. (This is with her in another room with the TV on, but again, once you notice it, you can't stop noticing.) Finally, got a Ducky with silent cherry red switches, and those are acceptable to her, so if you want a mechanical keyboard but others in the house may be disturbed, I'll recommend silent red cherry switches. (I'm sure there are others.) I got mine from mechanicalkeyboards.com though with silent reds, there is often a waiting time.


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## Alain De Vos (Jul 8, 2021)

Keyboard noise depends if you are alone at home or in a family. When I'm alone i like when the keyboard makes noise. It informs me that a key was pressed and it does not disturb me at all. But let's say you watch a scary movie then the noise of keyboard would be very disturbing.


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## Deleted member 30996 (Jul 8, 2021)

I've purchased one new PC with Win98SE and owned nothing but laptops since.

I like a laptop best because it is compact, has a smaller footprint that a PC, and everything is at my fingertips. Thinkpad models at W520 those before it considered by most to be the best keyboards made for a laptop. 

If I had a PC I'd have the noisiest IBM keyboard I could find and type as fast as I possibly could anytime I used it, probably be laughing at myself and loving every minute of it. I used a computer at the local library and when I saw the one they assigned me had an IBM keyboard, I was overjoyed at the chance to use one. I went to town on it fast as I could type and had those keys popping loud as I could. All these teenagers who were in the room were staring at me like something they had never seen before.

Like most people normally do anyway.

I've purchased 7 vintage Thinkpads off ebay and the only one that is not still  running like a manic malibu on meth is the X61. It threw a fan error on boot and shut down gracefully.

I know that's not what you're looking for but that suits my requirements for a desktop and all I'll ever buy


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## Geezer (Jul 8, 2021)

PCs are dead, extinct. Like Dinosaurs.

What is left is the birds and mammals. Or rather gaming machines and servers.


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## Beastie7 (Jul 8, 2021)

I'm a SFF person so I naturally like laptops (pro&gaming) and Intel NUCs.


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## George (Jul 8, 2021)

A laptop is more comfortable when lying on the couch though.

Put some art in the living room, not PCs.^^ Just kidding.


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## jmos (Jul 8, 2021)

Geezer said:


> PCs are dead, extinct.


Said a lot since years, but still not true. And as older you get the more you'll notice that sitting on a sofa with a laptop isn't ergonomic - you'll get backache, have a limited screen size, maybe heating problems, deal with a neutered keyboard in a bad position, false height of the monitor etc; You'll buy a big monitor, keyboard and a mouse and put all on a desk, buy a desk chair and ask yourself: Why do I need a notebook if it a) isn't used as a notebook anymore and b) isn't cheaper than a comparable PC?

Back to topic: To less information for any recommendation. Do you want to compile software on it? Video editing? Will it be just a file- and media- and backup-server? Or is it just about browsing the web and writing letters? 24/7 or only powered if needed? Does size matter?

I'm a fan of buying hardware components instead of a complete PC. And I still wouldn't choose ARM today (maybe in a few years when it comes more common - today it's *IMO* more a playground for nerds).

But as you're saying it's more a "process of collecting information"…:

I'm living under the roof and summers are hot. I don't want to heat up more than necessary, and we only have one earth. So I defined a limit of 65 W TDP for the CPU. 4 cores without multithreading (4 threads) or 3 cores with multithreading (6 threads) are *IMO* enough if it's just an office PC, but if it's used for virtual machines, compilers, video editing etc. I would say that 6/6 resp. 4/8 is a minimum. Multithreading isn't something I would insist of, in fact I would prefer a CPU without it (and get more single core performance instead). Hardly available anymore.

One basic decision: CPU bundled with GPU, or a separated graphic card? A separate card gives you more options - and even passive cards exist; In two PCs I've got passive NVIDIA GeForce GT 1030, and I'm happy with them; Not all of them on the market can do 4k@60 Hz, so a closer look in the specs is required.

That brings me back to the CPU: Maybe you want to take a closer look on AMDs Ryzen 5 3600x and Ryzen 7 3700x. The newer variants (both are "outdated") are IMO still to expensive.

Mainboard: I would explicit not choose PCIe 4 because of it's power consumption and temperature; And as far I know you wouldn't notice any difference of the faster speed of PCIe 4 compared to PCIe 3 on a desktop PC.

NVMe: Yes, as long you don't exceed 2 TB (costs). But I wouldn't choose a NVME which needs a heatsink. But I would add a heatsink. I'm happy with Corsairs MP510 serie. The successor MP600 produces more heat without any observable benefit.

That leads me to "cooling it": I really can recommend coolers from Noctua. Actually there exists even a passive monster ( https://noctua.at/en/nh-p1), but what I really like: I can interchange the fans of the coolers - I can buy them separate. And there are really low noise ones, and also there are "low noise adapters" which reduce the fan speed. Of course you've got to take care of the temperature, but the combination of "lowest speed and big cooler" so far always worked for me. Having that said: A bigger case is better. And I always change the fans shipped with the case. I don't want to hear anything of my PC (and I'm sensitive).

But as all components today are fast enough: Monitor, keyboard and mouse have to be as comfortable as possible. These are the components I would never try to save money. One single monitor instead of two (less stress!), as big as possible (but not bigger than 85 cm width / 50 cm height), lite (!) curved if it's wider than ~65 cm, and more than 92 DPI. A keyboard without numberpad is a good try - on laptops most users don't miss a keypad, so you can give it a try on the desktop, too. You're benefit is ergonomic as your mouse isn't far away from the chars of the keyboard. And as rooms lightness can differ in wide ranges before you put on a light: Black keybords are not as ergonomic as white ones. To my surprise I found out I want mechanic keyboards (Cherry silent red) - maybe you want to take a look at 80% premium customization on https://en.varmilo.com/keyboardproscenium/. I love them.

Oh my, I could write on for hours… but I think that's enough for a shoot into the blue.


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## Geezer (Jul 8, 2021)

jmos said:


> And as older you get ...


I hope I never get there.



jmos said:


> Said a lot since years, but still not true.



It was a bit tongue in cheek. I have just got a new PC, built from my choice of components, in a nice conservative black case, and with an enormous television as a monitor.

Dinosaurs are not dead. You just may not see another one for an awfully long time.


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## free-and-bsd (Jul 8, 2021)

Geezer said:


> PCs are dead, extinct. Like Dinosaurs.
> 
> What is left is the birds and mammals. Or rather gaming machines and servers.


For people who only use messengers and browse YouTube videos -- yes, that may be so. But for a serious work, reading, research, I can't see you doing that on an iPad. Or a laptop.
For that matter, I didn't care much for them when they became widely used -- until the day I lost my former profession (no just job) to computers .


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## TerabyteForever (Jul 8, 2021)

free-and-bsd said:


> For people who only use messengers and browse YouTube videos -- yes, that may be so. But for a serious work, reading, research, I can't see you doing that on an iPad. Or a laptop.


Yes. That's the reason why I've switched back to desktop again, the laptop was giving me aches. I couldn't sit in front of it for more than 2 hours.


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## Geezer (Jul 8, 2021)

Brand new dinosaur:


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## free-and-bsd (Jul 8, 2021)

OK, here's mine. I usually don't buy PCs but build my own -- cheaper that way, plus I use my own choice of components. The case remains the same, like this one below. Old HP Pavillion Slimline -- with new miniATX mobo, new power supply. And this funny button is a "remote" start/stop/reset button (old one was funky, but it broke down). Oh, and had to attach additional case fan (seen on the photo) for additional blowup to the CPU's own (slimline) cooler. Because the original suffered from overheat, poor thing.
So this is my way of 'buying new PC'. CPU usually Intel, mobo usually Gigabyte. Monitor -- anything but LED with their lousy colors.


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## Geezer (Jul 8, 2021)

I think this may need a new thread: Pictures of Boxes


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## free-and-bsd (Jul 8, 2021)

Case metal is becoming thinner... I remember my Pentium MMX box, my, it was a real survival monster. Metal like in a tank.


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## Beastie7 (Jul 8, 2021)

People buy laptops for the power/portability they provide.


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## free-and-bsd (Jul 8, 2021)

Beastie7 said:


> People buy laptops for the power/portability they provide.


Yes, in many situations portability=power.


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## hruodr (Jul 8, 2021)

And I ask the analogue questions:
Buying new Desktop PC for the bathroom.​


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## Geezer (Jul 8, 2021)

hruodr said:


> And I ask the analogue questions:
> Buying new Desktop PC for the bathroom.​



If you have a desk in your bathroom.


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## a6h (Jul 8, 2021)

I always assemble computers myself, never had a MAC/vendor/etc, and exclusively: Intel+[NVidia].


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## free-and-bsd (Jul 8, 2021)

hruodr said:


> And I ask the analogue questions:
> Buying new Desktop PC for the bathroom.​


Well, since you are the only person to knows what you're going to do with a PC in the bathroom, we can hardly advise


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## PMc (Jul 8, 2021)

Pics? me too! 
DIY, used parts. The case is in use since the nineties, fits into the deskside cabinet. Luck or design, it is less than 1/2 mm between cpu-cooler and disk-bay assembly:


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## astyle (Jul 8, 2021)

hruodr said:


> And I ask the analogue questions:
> Buying new Desktop PC for the bathroom.​


Yep, a 32-inch monitor mounted on the door, you sit on the throne while watching youtube... the box with the $3k RTX 3090 and a $5k Threadripper can be mounted on the ceiling, just get the DP cables down to the monitor...


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## garry (Jul 8, 2021)

Alain De Vos said:


> If you would buy today a new PC for your livingroom.
> [I would at least have the requirement for at least two network connections ...]



Mini-itx Gigabyte Z77 with wifi and dual Gb ethernet - $129
Antec Mini Skeleton-90 case with power supply - $119
Intel i5-3475s cpu - $40
16 GB of ddr3 1600Mhz 9x9x9 - $68


because
* I have a mini skeleton case in my living room.  Open, no dust accumulation, very compact, single 140mm150mm fan facing down onto the motherboard (almost silent), have 2 ssd and 2 HD in mine.
* I have Gigabyte Z77 boards (both ITX and micro-ITX) and everything works well with FreeBSD
* I like the Intel integrated graphics on the Intel cpus, it is well-supported, comes with the cpu (!$), and works good-enough.
* I love that i5-3475s for great combo of speed with low-power / low-temperatures
There are cons...

BTW, the included 90-watt ps is probably not adequate  I remove it and replace with 160 watt picoPSU -- plugs into the 20-pin atx power adapter.  The whole power supply is in the plug!  (need a 12V DC input from a wall wart).  Who needs more than 160 watts??

You'd also need a molex to sata adapter -- total system cost ~$425.


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