# X230 (first thinkpad on its way) need help deciding between Freebsd & Openbsd



## therue (Jun 24, 2018)

I have a desktop running archlinux which has nvidia gtx 780 gpu which i dont think is supported by either bsd, so sadly that will probably remain running linux in the future.  However, i specifically got a x230 thinkpad because i know itll be able to run both openbsd and freebsd as ive always been curious about bsd.  

The laptop will be for regular daily usage with some light programming, etc.  zfs is probably not an important factor as i keep all the downloads and important data on my desktop and possibly setting up a dedicated nas system in the future.   
DE is also not a priority as i prefer tiling wm and generally run all the typical cli applications. Although freebsd having more ports does sound tempting.  While openbsd i hear have the better documentations and seem to be considered as a more straightforward and simpler system which should be a better way to learn bsd ?  

But is there anything i should know about openbsd ahead of time that might make it a pain to use as a daily os? Like not having multithreading so the memory arent used as efficiently, or not being able to use flash for some common websites that requires it, or just in general being a lot slower?  
Freebsd does seem to have a very friendly community on the otherhand judging by the forum (which openbsd seems to lack)   

I did notice few people in the forum talking about having switched to openbsd so i am also interested to learn why people decided to stick with freebsd or why you decided on switching to openbsd.


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## shepper (Jun 24, 2018)

therue said:


> But is there anything i should know about openbsd ahead of time that might make it a pain to use as a daily os? Like not having multithreading so the memory arent used as efficiently, or not being able to use flash for some common websites that requires it, or just in general being a lot slower?


http://dmesgd.nycbug.org/index.cgi?do=index&fts=OpenBSD
http://www.undeadly.org/cgi?action=article;sid=20180620110722

In OpenBSD 6.3, the touchpad drivers were migrated from synaptic to libinput.  The libinput drivers are rudimentary and synaptic is still an option.


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## scottro (Jun 24, 2018)

There's lots of friendly OpenBSD folks on daemonforums.org.  For the sort of thing you're talking about, it seems as if either one would work for you. You could always dual boot them for awhile, and see if one catches your fancy more than the other.  I remember reading an old mutt vs. pine (now alpine) discussion and someone said, people pull up all sorts of technical reasons to support what is, in the end, an emotional decision.  

In theory, at least, FreeBSD is faster, OpenBSD more secure, but for general use, FreeBSD will probably be secure enough and OpenBSD probably fast enough. Some laptops don't like one or the other for some reason--for example, my Thinkpad L420 wouldn't boot OpenBSD till I disabled acpi.  OpenBSDs desktop tends to be a little better--syaptics working out of the box, where, at least for me, FreeBSD's synaptics can be iffy. 

You may find that one appeals to you more than the other, whether for practical or emotional reasons.  You should be able to try them both without too much trouble.


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## xtremae (Jun 24, 2018)

therue said:


> ...i am also interested to learn why people decided to stick with freebsd...





therue said:


> ...zfs is probably not an important factor...


OpenBSD is not an option for those who need / depend on zfs. In your case though, things seem to be a bit more _open, _meaning you can take both for a spin and decide for yourself.


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## CoTones (Jun 24, 2018)

Of course OpenBSD. Because "FreeBSD is for servers" TM. 
And I'm sure anonymous rich donators don't like FreeBSD Desktop idea.

PS there is some positive movement - TrueOS...


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## Sensucht94 (Jun 24, 2018)

therue said:


> I have a desktop running archlinux which has nvidia gtx 780 gpu which i dont think is supported by either bsd



Regarding this, gtx 780 is well supported in FreeBSD through the nvidia binary drivers and in NetBSD through nouveau (2D acceleration only,poor performancr compared to closed-source driver, but decent enough uo to 7xx series...as a Linux user you should know this all too well already ).

Regarding the Thinkpad, OpenBSD has traditionally the best Thinkpad hardware support, included very up to date Intel Graphics drivers, fantastic power management and perfect suspend/resume support. However it should work as shamelessly with any other BSD (user  i-bsd is posting videos on YouTube about his 6th gen Thinkpad X11 Carbon perfectly running FreeBSD, and with 8h battery life). Hence the choice ultimately  yours: try them all and decide which one meets your needs best  for yourself.


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## hitest (Jun 24, 2018)

I've used OpenBSD for a bit of time, since version 5.0.  However, I have moved my HP G62 laptop back to FreeBSD 11.1.  I found that network connectivity on OpenBSD 6.3 was intermittent.  On FreeBSD my WiFi network card is better supported.


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## teo (Jun 24, 2018)

hitest said:


> On FreeBSD my WiFi network card is better supported.


Pity in the BSDs there is still no support for my WiFi network card on Broadcom bcm4313.


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## Beastie7 (Jun 25, 2018)

therue said:


> The laptop will be for regular daily usage with some light programming, etc.



Just use FreeBSD and be done with it. 

It will simply facilitate a better user experience, and it will better address whatever use case you may end up with.


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## rigoletto@ (Jun 25, 2018)

therue said:


> I have a desktop running archlinux which has nvidia gtx 780 gpu which i dont think is supported by either bsd.



FreeBSD is the only BSD supported by nvidia.


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## gnath (Jun 25, 2018)

teo said:


> card on Broadcom bcm4313.


I am using BCM4312 with package b43-fwcutter and bwn-firmware-kmod. May try the same.


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## gnath (Jun 25, 2018)

therue said:


> for regular daily usage with some light programming, etc.


You will enjoy building FreeBSD WM with packages of your choice and help here.


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## kpedersen (Jun 25, 2018)

Because of the NVIDIA GPU, you might have to make do with FreeBSD and the binary blob driver as the only choice (personally, the one I would go for anyway .

Or if you really have your heart set on OpenBSD, then perhaps is a base Windows install with Hyper-V running OpenBSD as a guest acceptable? On annoying hardware, this is often the way I go for any FOSS platform. Think of Windows, as nothing other than a (bloated) driver platform compatibility layer.

To keep Windows from sh*tting on itself, you can force it to connect to the outside world only through the OpenBSD VM (proxy, ssh forwarding, ssh SOCKS) so you can keep almost 100% control and eliminate telemetry and pointless updates. Or keep it offline completely and just connect the guest OS to the internet (recommended).

As a bonus, you can use the unsupported Wifi card through the OpenBSD VM. Again because of the "platform compatibility layer".


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## scottro (Jun 25, 2018)

You could also use FreeBSD's implementation of VirtualBox and run OpenBSD in it. (Untested by me on an NVidia video, only used console).  There's also bhyve, which I've not really used, FreeBSD's own virtualization platform.   Or any minimal Linux with VirtualBox.  

But, if I'm understanding correctly, we're not even talking about NVidia, we're discussing a Thinkpad, right?


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## teo (Jun 25, 2018)

gnath said:


> I am using BCM4312 with package b43-fwcutter and bwn-firmware-kmod. May try the same.


But your machine has that BCM4313 driver? In that case, what would the procedure be?


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## gnath (Jun 26, 2018)

My bad. May try https://forums.freebsd.org/threads/howto-freebsd-9-1-release-on-asus-eee-pc-1018p.39771/#post-220816 section 11. Wireless .


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